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Old 03-05-2006, 11:42 AM   #1
Tombo5150
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Intonating floyd?


Okey dokey.....I just finished the floyd mod on my olp and it's my first floyd. I'm havin some intonation problems. The 12th is not the same as open, thats for sure. Also, I've got a d tuna on it, I've heard several ways that people tune with that on. Could someone just explain how to do a few of these things for me? It'd be a great help!

PS-I've got the Floyd "key" thing, that plays into the tuning doesn't it?
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Old 03-05-2006, 01:08 PM   #2
billandgitana
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is the 12 fret harmonic high or low? first off...
and is it off on all the strings?
is it off the same amount on all the strings...
give them more info and they can get ya all fixed up....
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Old 03-05-2006, 01:21 PM   #3
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El knows alot about this topic. Talk to him. The Key will move the saddles into place so the 12th fret harmonic is correct. It is needed. He can help you, and im sure there are others that can as well.
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Old 03-05-2006, 03:47 PM   #4
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OOO! It's a harmonic i'm sposed to hit.....
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Old 03-05-2006, 07:35 PM   #5
El_jalepeno
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Harmonic on the twelth fret. Tune your strings, then hit the harmoinic for each string on the twelth fret. The harmionc should register identical to the open note. If it is flat or sharp, then you adjust the saddle forward or back respectively. Use a tuner for this excercise

You said you already have the Floyd tool. Good, you will need it to do this properly and almost effortlessly.
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Old 03-06-2006, 04:55 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El_jalepeno
Harmonic on the twelth fret. Tune your strings, then hit the harmoinic for each string on the twelth fret. The harmionc should register identical to the open note. If it is flat or sharp, then you adjust the saddle forward or back respectively. Use a tuner for this excercise
Ahem....I hate to jump in here EJ....but I think you have a type-O.

The open string the the harmonic in the center on it (12th fret) will always be exactly the same...regradless of the lenght of the string.

What you have to do is match the open string up to the note when you fret the 12th fret. If the 12th fret note is sharp move teh saddle back...flat move it forward to the nut.

I only know this because I do it a lot.
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Old 03-06-2006, 05:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VHFan
Ahem....I hate to jump in here EJ....but I think you have a type-O.

The open string the the harmonic in the center on it (12th fret) will always be exactly the same...regradless of the lenght of the string.

What you have to do is match the open string up to the note when you fret the 12th fret. If the 12th fret note is sharp move teh saddle back...flat move it forward to the nut.

I only know this because I do it a lot.
Thanks VH. We intonate in the first place because the saddles are not perfectly distanced. This was recently demonstrated when I bought (and took back!) a Boss chromatic tuner to check my intonation. I did check the tone based on the fretted note and the harmonic, then decided to use my ear since I was the one playing!

Actually, mathematically perfect intonation involves measuring to the middle of the twelth fret wire from each saddle and matching it with the distance of the nut to the middle of the fret wire. It just doesn't always sound "perfect".

However, the string height does need to be considered for the intonation because if the string height is just high enough, it would take additional pressure to move the string down and create more tension on the string throwing it out of the harmonic range, which as mentioned is the easiest way to intonate. You should also fret the note to compensate for string height since when you actually play you are fretting rather than playing harmonics. Getting the tone at the 12th fretted and 12th harmonic is where you want to put your money. There are also debates on 5th and 17th frets accuracy, but we'll save that for later.

Of course, as you mentioned you do it a lot where as I hardly do it at all. "Nothing but a Good Time" would be indicative of intonation problems since some of the chords are played above the twelth fret as well as below. If I recall correctly when your wife threw her bra on stage at the gig last month, you both thought the guitar sounded good. Coincidence? Only my hairdresser knows for sure! But, yes, I would strongly recommend you intonate based on fretted notes and harmonics at the twelth since it is your playing that will impact the intonation. That is why so many guys come back from the guitar store with unhappy setups because they weren't a part of the setup process.

And let me add that because of debates such as this, Buzz Feiton has a system that supposedly resolves these questions. I don't know about the BF system first hand, but if anyone else does I would love to hear about it
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Last edited by El_jalepeno; 03-06-2006 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 03-06-2006, 07:37 PM   #8
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All true E.J.....I just wanted to make the point that the open string and the harmonic at the center (somewhere around the 12th fret) are always the exact same frequency so unless you start checking fretted notes you are barking up the wrong tree when you start moving saddles.

As far as I can tell with my strobe tuner....if the fretted note on the 12th lines up, all the other fretted notes line up....up and down the neck almost exactly on all of my guitars. I guess this is due to the fact that all of my korean necks are made on CNC machines and those Asian guys seem to have it pretty much nailed after producing 1000's of them....LOL

On the buzz system (which I don't have) they move the nut slightly on 1 or 2 of the strings.......not sure how much difference it really makes.
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